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3. Brook Trout Fishing the Black River in Northern Michigan

We recently found this forum and just wanted to introduce ourselves.


Michigan Gone Wild is in pursuit of late summer Brook Trout on the Black River in Northern Michigan. With a combination of terrestrials, wet fly's, spoons and spinners, Jordan and Joe team up with TFO rods in hand to put some Brookies in the net. Jordan offers some great advise for capitalizing on late summer Brook Trout while using tactics that have been a trade mark on the Black River for almost a century.

Stay Wild!

Well... Nicely produced. But, watching two guys trout fishing, who apparently don't really trout fish all that much, is kinda like watching two random guys armchair quarterbacking a football game. I normally ascribe to "If you have nothing nice to say, say nothing". But the fake 3wt post associated with you guys, and the ham-fisted attempts at advertising both yourselves and TFO in your vid has me bothering to respond. Some advice: Up your game -a whole lot- or find a more naive/gullible audience to ply.

What Paul said.

Gotta' say something, these 'advertisement/posts' have me bothered. Please don't get the impression that all MI flyfishers are this opportunistic and flog the water like neophytes...most of us are serious and take our sport seriously.

There's a lot more of us on Troutnut- and on the water- who aren't out for a buck.

Roguerat- MI fly-fisher for 23 yrs and not out looking for attention or $$...

Where's the worm can & salmon eggs? BTW you might of done some research as to the premise of the Troutnut web site. It is primarily a web site that discusses, and provides excellent photographs, of aquatic insects and pretty much the followers are fly fishermen.

Tough Crowd! Thank you all for watching anyways. As for the Stereotypical comments, I'm very sorry you all responded negatively. We work very hard to produce videos that entice anglers to fish for species they previously have never fished for and also to share our adventures with anglers alike. To the best of my knowledge, forums are meant to inform and entertain anglers no matter what skill level. Based on your comments I'm sure you are all the dedicated fly fisherman you portray yourselves to be. With that being said no one in this video ever claimed to be an expert at fishing. Our approach to this video was to highlight the effectiveness of both conventional and fly tackle during the late summer season while also provoking a sense of appreciation towards a river that one of the fisherman has fished on since he was a child. Clearly each and every one of you missed the point of this video and may not be the audience we are targeting. I am completely fine with that. But if your approach to a Trout stream and fellow anglers is anything like your comments towards this video I suggest you stay off the river and internet all together. As for the money the one gentlemen spoke of, please do let me know when a check comes in the mail. It would be greatly appreciate it. Hopefully you will all like our next video! Tight lines, Stay Wild!

Nice try. I don’t believe we missed the point of the video. And yes, you blundered into a "tough crowd" like a bull into a china shop.

First, as to the "stereotyping"... Although this site is fly-fishing focused, I and most of us here don’t have anything against conventional fishing; I happen to love pitching hardware to trout and other critters. It’s all good in my book; there’s tons to be learned and appreciated in doing so. No one here has anything against helping new anglers –except maybe when we see they are primarily being marketed to.

"But the fake 3wt post associated with you guys, and the ham-fisted attempts at advertising both yourselves and TFO in your vid has me bothering to respond.":

In case you think we didn't notice:



If you are not primarily trying to market your video program, web site, guide service, TFO rods (possibly a sponsor or hoped for one), tackle shop (that pushes TFO rods), or are working for the MI DNR (along with a TFO sponsor), then there may simply be a culture clash going on here.

The marketing world –the one that has melded itself to the bass fishing and hunting worlds for instance– sticks out like a sore thumb here. This site is an information-rich resource and it attracts those who want to do WAY more than scratch the surface, much less simply be marketed to. If you had done your “market research”, or simply paid this site the courtesy of familiarizing yourself with it before posting, you’d have seen your video was a very poor fit.

Some advice:
-Don’t say the brand name of your tackle (esp more than once), unless you are doing a commercial. In the real interest of sharing your knowledge and a favorite fishing spot with the world –and you do have a sponsor– show the rod in a nice eye-candy shot of a good fish.
-For this audience in particular, don’t kill the biggest trout you caught, and then man-handle it in front of the camera. Instead, maybe show a tasteful shot of trout on some moss or ferns or something.

Hey, no one is mean here. We’re annoyed at seeing a poorly veiled promotional video -the very reason we turn our TV’s off and spend that time outdoors. Up your game to match the site and try again, or pick a different audience.

Paul,

Its so reassuring to us members of this village that our junkyard dog is manning the periphery keeping the wolves at bay!

"When the Stranger says: 'What is the meaning of this city?
Do you huddle close together because you love each other?'
What will you answer? 'We all dwell together
To make money from each other? or 'This is a community'?

..."So they built as men must build
With the sword in one hand and the trowel in the other."

..."the trowel in one hand, and the gun rather loose in the holster"...

Pardon the misuse of Mr Eliot's "Choruses From the Rock" to make a tortured point. I'm glad you are manning the gates...:)

I'm a bit surprised that Jason hasn't sent them packing. He must be somewhere on the tundra with his spear in hand.

Your comparison to the bass whackers is spot on. We will all be wearing sponsorship jackets when we hit the stream next season and all will be a big competition...Metal flake boats with Chevy block motors in them will be blasting right up the middle of the "Holy Water"...:)

Concerning your point about being ok with hardware, I fear the treble hook damage to fish that aren't being "harvested", and the "leveling" of the playing field that spinning gear and Mepps spinners gives a guy that is too lazy to learn the finer points of fly fishing. :) But I do understand your point...We all started there and learned what we learned from it.

Anyway...we are back to square one where us traditionalists are pained by the new world order, where "flies only" waters are being plied by 3 inch articulated streamers that may as well be Mepps spinners...

A good friend of mine told me to forget all the crap and just do my own thing and approach my fishing as I see fit, and screw the rest of them. :)

Friend number two, who use to fish the Black regularly, use to tell me that there are no fish in the Black...;)

How's that for an opaque ramble?!

Spence

[Anyway...we are back to square one where us traditionalists are pained by the new world order, where "flies only" waters are being plied by 3 inch articulated streamers that may as well be Mepps spinners...]

Off on a tangent here, but I'm curious how many fly-fishers use articulated streamers? I tied up some Heifer Groomers (TX to Kelly Galloup for the bizarre name and pattern) and used them with some success on the Flower Flats stretch of the Big Manistee in July. Not quite 3" long but close...

Roguerat

'Less is more...'

Ludwig Mies Vande Rohe

I certainly do not want to be the junkyard dog. But sometimes things just need to be said.

As to hardware (and bass-whackin'), I really do love both. I've spent a lot of wonderful time fishing spinners and jigs on UL tackle for trout. There's way more to it than most probably realize.

I actually see as much or more damage to fish mouths on fly-only C&R waters -mostly due to sheer repetition, but also from overzealous reactions. I once wondered why all the small trout were missing maxilla's on some of my harder pressed waters, until I saw a beginner in one of my ff camps excitedly strike so hard that all she got for her (rather spastic) effort was a maxilla!

Yes, barbed trebles can be nasty. There are lots of ways to damage fish yet there are things we can do to lessen that if we bother. Barbless or micro-barbs can work with spinners and I've even swapped out trebles for single hooks on some of them. As a confirmed bass-whacker, I also do what almost no one seems willing to even try and that is going barbless with a lot of my lures, including trebled crankbaits and topwaters. They catch just fine and the hooks just shake out of the fish in hand. No more mangled jaws.

So if you are telling me I need to stay off the river, or off Troutnut, I'll just suggest YOU stay off this site, and keep the next video to yourself. I've fished with a number of the guys here, and found them to be fine company who respect each other, the water, the fish, and the sport.

I could not agree more with Spence and Martin, remember the days on the ausable below foote dam, and the crowd that just had to show everyone how they could catch them salmon. And then the steelhead guys I used to fish with who were so good at raking gravel you could hardly tell there were snagging. We don't need commericals on this site, and really someone telling me I need to off the rivers, really dude were are you coming from.

Yes, Paul, I have seen this also. Especially in hot spots out west.

I remember a 17" Rainbow I caught just above the $3 Bridge in 1995. I was suppose to be practicing short-line nymphing techniques when I saw the fish rise...I quickly extended my leader and tied on a small caddis and the fish took it...One side was missing the maxilla...It seemed to prefer taking flies on just one side of it's mouth? One side tore up badly.

Had another on the Galatin...The stretch along the highway in the Park in 2004...Same deal. A ripped up mouth.

It makes me a little concerned, especially here in Michigan, where we have extended some of the season, that maybe we aren't giving these fish a break. A season should allow some down time where reproduction can occur and the fish can relax just a bit. Some places, especially near the access site's, there's a constant thundering herd.

Maybe too much of a good thing.

Spence

I couldn't agree more. Matter of fact, if the Catskill season was shortened by 2 months on each side I would be all over that. We have a bunch of streams that have early closures and late openings [both for the purpose of letting the spawning browns and bows have some space and time] and I don't feel they are early and late enough.

Sorry to get off topic! CJ

Don't worry...We've been trying to change this topic. :)

Spence

I must be hanging around the wrong fly shops. It's been 61 years and no one has ever asked me if I've tried a coachman. By the way, some of the articulated streamers being used on Michigan's lower AuSable are 6" or more in length. Don't forget to duck..

To Spence:

Your good friends advice seems to be most appropriate. We all do our own tying, casting,playing, and landing. Not to mention selecting of flies, water and times. It this isn't individualized, what is?

Hey, if there are gators in a water body and it takes a 6" fly to interest them, I have no problem with breaking out the 7wt. In smaller waters anyway, some trout will live their whole lives and may never be caught on a fly-sized fly. I've pursued them with a streamer (ofttimes with a leadcore head), a waking fly (at dusk or night), and I've done it with a Mepps and Rapala too. I'm more interested in the fish and water than I am in the gear. Love those dime-sized spots!

I agree. This same water also has some of those fish rising in the Spring to size #12 and #14 Hendricksons. 26.5" is the largest I know of caught during that hatch.

Wow. That's a big bug-eater. Many of the "home waters" I've fished just aren't productive enough to feed the gators on insects. They have a whole different lifestyle, although we do catch them nymphing on occasion. Odds go up in the right stretch, timing, tackle and fly though.